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Jocelyn Malone

June 27, 2019 at 01:28 AM UTC


I haven’t been able to read through all the comments yet, but here are my thoughts:

My money is on Pet as an heirling in some way–her parents were clearly in hiding from SOMETHING, and I think they probably weren’t vanilla-standard humans of some kind. I would not be unhappy to find that it’s a twist and she’s something we haven’t learned about yet, though.

This book, particularly, had a lot of funny moments, it’s hard to pick!

I don’t think she has a favorite any more. She did earlier on, but having lived with all three for a while, she has clearly found things she likes in all three. It will be very interesting to see the direction different relationships take, since there are quite a few books still ahead!

There’s no way Morgana is entirely human (or at least, living a fully human life), but the jury is out (to me) on whether Morgana herself knows (or guesses) that. Whether she’s playing human or really doesn’t realize the weirdness around her we’ll have to wait and see. I really like Pet’s friendship with her, so I hope it doesn’t take a creepy-bad turn at some point (I’m not seeing that just yet, but you never know).

Eleniel

June 27, 2019 at 05:32 PM UTC


Having read Shades of Blue, I have to wonder if Morgana isn’t part mer. Like Marazul. It would explain why she’s stuck in bed if there’s something wrong with her legs. And she sounds raspy when she breathes- maybe she’s not used to air. Just a thought.

Lynn

June 27, 2019 at 06:08 PM UTC


That would be awesome! I’d like that twist if Morgana being a part Mer and her name and appearance being a red herring. What do you think all of the “kids” are? There is something really creepy feeling there. Do you think it’s also a red herring designed to make us worry but is not as creepy as we’re thinking? Or is it something sinister?

Colleen

June 28, 2019 at 05:40 AM UTC


Morgana’s setup with the mirrors makes her a dead ringer for Elaine! From the poem Lady of Shalott ( I think WR Gingell might be following poems in this series?). Plus with her name Morgana, has to be a way to bring more of Arthurian legend into City Between, but think of it!! Super exciting to think if w r Gingell explains Arthurian legend in our world the way Diana Wynn’s Jones explains Arthurian legend in Hexwood! Eg by explaining more of the Behind and Between worlds and how Arthurian legends (and where Arthur is buried…?) fit in behind and between and behindkind…? Other thoughts from between frames on the Arthurian link – don’t want to spoil it—-ugh waiting !

Lynn

June 28, 2019 at 07:20 PM UTC


Great catch Colleen and another very intriguing possibility. I am not familiar with that poem but taking a quick look online it does bear a striking resemblance. I would never had known about it if you hadn’t mentioned it here.

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Lynn

June 27, 2019 at 02:23 AM UTC


I hope Pet’s friendship with Morgana continues and grows too. Pet needs some strong female friendships since she is surrounded by males. But I am worried about all the strangeness that surrounds Morgana and what that might mean. So all of this to say that, like you, I hope that friendship doesn’t take a creepy-bad turn!

Lindsay

June 26, 2019 at 02:22 AM UTC


Okay so, I’ve been reading these books from the start and I have to say JinYeong is my favorite character, hands down. He is SUCH a little turd sometimes that it makes me laugh. And he sprays himself down with cologne like a teenage boy with Axe body spray.
And when Pet took just one ring off the curtain rods and then made all the pictures in the house off center just to mess with him… that’s HILARIOUS!
I love these books so much. As to a romantic attachment… I havent read the newest book yet (I’m waiting for a block of uninterrupted time) but as of book 3 she seems to kinda like Marazul, the half merman from the short story. But it’s hard to say.
All three of the psychos are attached to her in their own ways, despite their best efforts to remain unmoved.
I just wish I knew korean so I knew exactly what JinYeong is saying. 🙂

Elizabeth

June 25, 2019 at 04:18 AM UTC


Now I’m sorry I waited so long to come here. It’s a lot of fun! It’s really interesting to see how the same event is interpreted in different ways. I had just assumed that the reason a fake Pet was used to try and get info out of Athelas was because of the familiar way she spoke (or was trying to speak) with Athelas when she called him. But obviously they knew who she was, even if Athelas didn’t really buy the reproduction. Someone knew enough to pretend to be Zero when she tried calling from Between.

I also wasn’t really picking up on Athelas being gentler as he killed her, since she woke up one time thinking he’d cradled her head as she died, but when she really woke up Zero was the one doing that and the other time JinYeong was the one with his arms around her. I saw it more as Zero and JinYeong being horrified by what they’d just seen and wanting to comfort Pet. Maybe both can be true? I do think that killing someone who seemed like Pet so many times was really wearing Athelas down. It was interesting that he was so determined to keep sensitive Pet-related info from his kidnappers.

Faith

June 25, 2019 at 08:04 AM UTC


Yes, it’s so interesting to see everyone’s thoughts! I assumed both were true and it was more of an artistic coincidence and/or dream magic that they ended up doing both at the same time. It’s a bonus that I loved about the whole process- not only do you get to see how much he cares about Pet, you get to see all three of them upset about her death in their own way.

Rachael Liankatawa

June 25, 2019 at 03:36 AM UTC


I love the zapping scene with JinYeong! One of my all-time favorites! Though soothing her with the times tables was such a cute scene as well.

I think Pet prefers them all in different ways. Zero for protection, Athelas for information, and JinYeong for entertainment 😂. I originally thought she preferred Zero to anyone else if we’re talking romance…but I don’t think so now (but that is due to already having read the next book).

Caitlin

June 25, 2019 at 11:49 PM UTC


It was shocking to me (in an absolutely delightful way) to see JinYeong do something unquestionably, unselfishly *nice* for Pet. He is really growing on me as a character. Also I love your idea Elizabeth’s idea that this is something he used to do for his sister <3

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Elizabeth

June 25, 2019 at 04:25 AM UTC


I really liked the times tables part as well. It’s the kind of thing I can imagine him doing that as a kid for his sister when she was afraid or upset. Maybe he did. Maybe he was into math before and then that got super magnified when he was turned and that’s why he’s so “numbers loving” now.

Faith Kim

June 25, 2019 at 05:33 PM UTC


It is a great scene. That is a really sweet idea, I hadn’t thought of that. 🙂

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Rachael Liankatawa

June 25, 2019 at 04:32 AM UTC


I love the idea of him comforting his sister that way. Maybe he was also already ocd before becoming a vampire!

Caitlin

June 24, 2019 at 09:58 AM UTC


This is my favorite book too!!! And for so many reasons that it is hard for me to coherently discuss them 😛 But I will try.

Funniest scene: For me, hands down, it is the biscuit-chase scene near the end of the book. I love that scene and always end up re-reading it a few times before finally finishing the book. It has so much humor plus I love the way each character’s personality, and their relationship with Pet, shines so clearly in such a lighthearted scene. It also shows how enmeshed in everyones’ lives Pet has become—whether they are willing to admit it or not.

Other laugh out loud moments:
-Pet threatening Athelas with supermarket tea. As an avid tea drinker myself, I found this threat both hilarious and diabolical.
-Tuatu’s texts. Nuff said.
-Athelas is Fae Google. (“This is why I needed an Athelas. He might be tricky to deal with, but at least he didn’t run out of data or battery.”)
-Zero loves pancakes. Not actually a joke, but it makes me grin from ear to ear to know that about him.
-JinYeong’s genuine shock and horror when Pet disparages his magnificent self. Like telling him he stinks, or is too old to be called Oppa. I died.

Lingering Questions:
-Why did JinYeong fall asleep and what is the significance of that fact? It must be significant since JinYeong was surprised AND lied about it to Zero. Plus Pet has said before that the vampire does not sleep.
-Why does Pet check under her bed?

Plot Inklings and Other Musings:
-“Even if my parents had turned evil for a bit, I still don’t thing I’d be able to forgive someone for killing them.” That better not be foreshadowing Ms. Athelas-The-Twisty-Author!
-The scene with Pet and JinYeong at the end (with the suit). On the first read through, I took that to mean that it was not worth it for Pet to get between Zero and JinYeong and try to keep the peace between them. But I kind of like Kitty’s theory better 😀
-I think Pet finds Zero to be the most comfortable/comforting to be around so far. She has the most faith in him to protect her. And she seems to find his solid, silent presence comforting. Not sure if that is the same as liking him the best though or not.
-What is Pet and what is Morgana? Gonna save my thoughts for the next discussion when there is no danger of spoilers 😀

Jocelyn Malone

June 26, 2019 at 03:23 AM UTC


The supermarket tea delighted me, too (I am also a huge tea drinker and mostly go loose-leaf).

Caitlin

June 26, 2019 at 05:26 AM UTC


Yes! Tea connoisseurs unite 😀

Eleniel

June 26, 2019 at 07:19 PM UTC


Tea is better than coffee in my opinion. It’s a nuanced process though, finding one that has the right balance in taste. (I sound like a snob) 😀

W.R. Gingell

June 27, 2019 at 11:01 AM UTC


Connoisseurs unite! I can’t drink coffee (though I love the smell), but I LOVE my leaf tea <3 =)

Eleniel

June 27, 2019 at 05:42 PM UTC


I’ll take of few sips if my dad has a really good black coffee, but otherwise it has to be very sweet and made with twice as much milk as coffee. Tea is still better, though!

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Caitlin

June 27, 2019 at 08:55 AM UTC


Not a snob—connoisseur. Or at least that is what I tell myself cause other wise I am definitely a tea snob. It is so much better than coffee though, and the hunt for a really good blend just adds to the fun.

Eleniel

June 27, 2019 at 05:35 PM UTC


It really is. My mother has a specific way she likes tea- a good black, not too smoky, steeped five minutes. Add a spoonful of honey and enough milk to make it caramel colored, and bam. (I was always the main tea child. 😛 )

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W.R. Gingell

June 26, 2019 at 08:34 AM UTC


Yeah, we can make new blends that way 😉

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Rachael Liankatawa

June 25, 2019 at 04:30 AM UTC


Ooh I didn’t think about the significance of JinYeong falling asleep. Maybe being around Pet makes him more human? I figured he lied to Zero because he was embarrassed about spending/wasting time comforting Pet when Athelas was in danger.

Faith

June 25, 2019 at 06:42 AM UTC


Hm, that’s a good point! I also figured that he lied to Zero for the reasons you mentioned above, and I still do. But maybe there’s more to it? Zero knew he could sleep because that was required for helping Pet out that night, so I didn’t think him sleeping in itself was something to hide. Thinking about it again though, it could still be significant that he fell asleep after the whole magical visit to Athelas (as Caitlin said, he was surprised, he doesn’t usually sleep, and the magical nature of the visit may have been an exception).
I’ve never considered it, but your theory about making him more human is interesting. There are actually a few other things besides him falling asleep that could be explained if it were true. The fact that Jinyeong can’t smell her or anything else when he’s with her and Athelas’ constant amusement with how she affects Jinyeong and vague comments and curiosity on how she seems to change him could both point to her making him more human when they’re together. It could also explain why he’s so warm, which Pet mentions all the time. I assumed it was the way vampires are in this book (like how he can eat garlic, etc), but it could just as easily be something else.
Either way, I’ve never considered the possibility of what Pet’s affects on Jinyeong might mean beyond making her identity ambiguous and confusing, but now this is making me wonder… What other affects does she have on him besides messing with his smell? And why?

Rachael Liankatawa

June 25, 2019 at 08:07 AM UTC


Yes, I was thinking about the warm comments too. Is he always warm or just when he’s around Pet? Not much way of knowing since she is the pov but an interesting thought to be on the lookout for clues in future books! It’s fun to think that JinYeong might get some of his humanity back. Although I’m also of the theory that if he and Pet end up together then Pet is going to be completely immune to turning vampire.

Faith Kim

June 25, 2019 at 05:37 PM UTC


That was another thing I was considering. If they do end up together, him becoming more human when he’s with her could help clear up the whole different species issue.
Also, really? Someone mentioned he was cold?? Now that you mention it, it actually sounds vaguely familiar…

Elizabeth

June 26, 2019 at 12:33 PM UTC


Sorry, just to clarify, I could absolutely be that JinYeong is warmer because of Pet and that he’s different in other ways around her as well.

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Elizabeth

June 26, 2019 at 12:19 PM UTC


I thought I remembered something about JinYeong being cold as well. Looks like in Between Floors his mouth is both cold and warm when he’s biting her on the shoulder to heal her. Then when Pet and JinYeong are hiding under that desk in the police station his fingers are cold when he grabs her wrist. She calls him a “dead cold fish” too. Looks like his hand is cold when he’s holding it over her eyes towards the end as well.

It’s kinda funny, Pet talks about how he won’t feel cold a few times, but if I remember correctly, every time he takes a shower he uses a lot of hot water. Could be just because he enjoys it, or just because he can.

But I do remember plenty of other times when she’s surprised that he’s warm. Maybe he’s warmer when he’s had blood recently? Not sure. After all, people are warm sometimes and cold sometimes too, right?

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Lynn

June 25, 2019 at 06:48 PM UTC


I’m not sure I connected all of this with JIn Yeong. That’s why I love book discussions. Other people always catch stuff you miss, especially in a world as complicated as this with as little information as we get. Plus there are the red herrings. I’ll probably do a quick reread before book 6 or 7 and now I’ll have more to keep my eye on, like the changes in Jin Yeong..

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Kadi

June 25, 2019 at 10:28 AM UTC


I feel like someone mentions JinYeong being cold at some point. I will have to go back and check it out but I’ve never put it together all the different ways she affects him like not smelling like food and him being warm and the sleeping. So interesting!

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Faith

June 25, 2019 at 04:26 AM UTC


Yes, I also loved the biscuit scene, for ALL the reasons you mentioned above! Like you said, they way it showed how enmeshed Pet’s life vice versa, their personalities, the unique ways they’re close to each other, the humor, etc… Such an awesome scene to end on! I also re-read it so many times before finishing a re-read of the book…. 😀
Also, for whatever reason, I was completely blanking on what the texts were until now. Which is ridiculous because they were one of my favorites to start with! But I just remembered, and I agree with what you and what so many other have mentioned… They are so, SO hilarious.

Eleniel

June 24, 2019 at 01:43 AM UTC


I don’t know. But whatever she is, I am almost positive the “Kids” are some sort of Behindkind. They seem shady to me.

Lynn

June 24, 2019 at 06:32 AM UTC


That whole situation seems shady to me too. There is definitely more there than we know yet. I also don’t buy these absentee parents bit. Something is off. I can’t figure out why Pet hasn’t picked up on the weird except for the fact that she’s lived with weird for quite a while. I guess going with the weird is how she’s survived to an extent.

Caitlin

June 24, 2019 at 10:19 AM UTC


I agree. The situation with Morgana seems really odd. But I also agree that Pet’s sense of what constitutes “normal human behavior” may be a bit off.

Kadi

June 24, 2019 at 01:18 AM UTC


This Book was so amazing. There are so many different parts that I just loved.

So first of all I totally think that Pet is some kind of behindkind and that her parents or one parent was as well. I also think she is a heirling as well. There is too much about her that is strange and not quite human that makes me sure the she can’t be all human and the fact that she can pick up the sword makes me thinking she can be a heirling( I hope that is this books. I admit I’ve read ahead).

I have to admit I don’t know if I have a favorite funny scene. There are a lot of good ones such as the kiss from JinYeong, and the text from the detective. Pet is just a funny character and her interactions with everyone are pretty great and I can’t choose a favorite.

Also I really couldn’t say if Pet prefers one over others. I think , like is mentioned in other comments, she looks at them each differently but is starting to love them all. She always jokes about being their Pet but in her dedication to helping them and finding Athelas you can tell she really cares. I think she thinks of Zero as the pig boss and her protector, Athelas is her mentor and JinYeong is her annoying friend who is always pestering her but she enjoys pestering him back.

I think someone made a good comment that Pet sometimes has a hard time identifying her feelings and I think that makes it hard for her to choose one of another. I don’t think at this point she see’s anyone as a romantic interest yet but I think JinYeong is starting to become more interested in her that way.

I totally noticed how gently Athelas would hold her head each time he would kill her. Even though that was so sad I still love how those experiences developed their relationship and showed that she is someone important to him.

I just can’t wait to see how this series develops more!!! I feel like we are still only just getting glimpses of everything and there is still so much yet to come!

Kadi

June 24, 2019 at 01:21 AM UTC


*big boss

Auto correct is the worst

W.R. Gingell

June 24, 2019 at 05:27 AM UTC


No, autocorrect is the best because “pig boss” made me laugh SO MUCH 😂😂😂

Diane_L

June 23, 2019 at 12:05 AM UTC


I totally missed the connection to the poem The Highway Man! I’m ashamed because that is one of my favorite poems, too. (Obviously not favorite enough to have memorized the lines, though.)
I re-read this book and took tons of notes, which I probably won’t get to use. I, too, think that pet is an Heirling, and that her paralyzed friend is either a lot more than she seems, or the circumstances around her are. And I’m sure the kids are some kind of Behindkind, too.
I’m also certain that Zero is so reluctant to help because of what happened the first time he made an unofficial unit in the Enforcers to do so. I wonder who it was that worked with him who was killed. His family seems to excel at murdering those close to someone in order to control them.
What about Jin Yeong’s comment that at some time in the future Pet would smile when she smelled the fragrance of his cologne somewhere because it would remind her of him? That seems to me to show the possibility that he wants a closer relationship with Pet.
And does anyone else have trouble with Athelas’s name reminding them of the Greek word (alétheia ) for”truth”? It’s obviously NOT the same, but it keeps niggling at me

Faith Kim

June 23, 2019 at 12:48 AM UTC


I totally missed that connection with the highwayman too, and I thought it was so cool!
Yeah, in the words Ms. KM Shea, I think it’s pretty clear Jin Yeong’s “got it BAD for pet”. I’m pretty sure he’s starting to like her in a romantic way, and if not romantically, he makes it pretty clear he really likes her period. In addition, oh boy, here comes a long one. It’s just hard not saying too much about Between Floors. :/ The primary way Koreans show care and affection tend to innately be less verbal, and it was very fun for me to see that type affection build with each passing book in someone like Jinyeong, where that tendency obviously would be doubly, triply true.
And then, I think we can all agree- all that care sure culminated in this one! Intuition, actions, and food (with a very special emphasis on FOOD) are foundational to how Koreans show care. So as a Korean, when I saw him carefully watching her, sporadically looking out for her, randomly doing stuff to help her, and (emphasis on this next one) shoving food towards her or telling her to eat when she seems down/not doing well, was a huge, heartwarming red flag about how much he actually cares about her. Additionally, note when Pet complains about “what’s up with you and personal space?” XD Becoming close to someone as a Korean sometimes means personal space instinctively ceases to really exist anymore. I don’t whether it was intentionally done that way to show that or not, but it definitely made me laugh out loud at the accuracy.

Diane

June 23, 2019 at 01:31 AM UTC


I didn’t know that about Korean culture, Faith. It certainly ups the ante with his interactions with Pet. And how he might interpret her interactions with him. I do agree that she reacts to each of them differently as kind-of like siblings/family. And one of the ways she shows care is with food. Pancakes for Zero, special tea and shortbread for Athelas, and blood sncks and kimchi for JinYeong. JinYeong might read more into it than is justified.
Not a very vigorous discussion today. I was so hoping for one. Pet said that Athelas killing her showed that he could be wrong. I was wondering if he was actually also right. Pet couldn’t escape the first dream until after she found the construct holding him in the dream and he killed her. And he was certainly right that escaping from imprisonment by moonlight required self-sacrifice.

Faith Kim

June 23, 2019 at 01:44 AM UTC


That is an interesting thought- I think you’re right, he was at least partially right. But I think Pet was referring more to the fact that he thought that she wasn’t actually herself when he was killing her, which he was wrong about.
Concerning cultural differences, I don’t know if it would necessarily cause any misunderstandings, but I think it does add a fun layer. I personally don’t think he would misinterpret her giving him food as something more than it actually is (when I meant care and affection, I meant all types, aka family and friendship as well, not just romance, and particularly at this pont, it’s pretty clear that Pet doesn’t have feelings for him), but I do think it seems to make him particularly happy, which again, is fun for me to see. 😀

Lynn

June 23, 2019 at 06:11 PM UTC


It’s great to have the input of someone who understands the Korean culture and things we might miss. I have sensed that Pet misunderstands some of Jin Yeong’s actions and what they mean. She usually thinks everything he does it to annoy her. But he used to be human and is probably the most connected to his humanity of all 3 psychos, so to think that he is just like the other two would be to discount both his Korean background and any ties left to his humanity.

I wonder if Jin Yeong’s “cologne” is his vampire smell or something. I’ve wondered this for a while.

Faith

June 25, 2019 at 07:40 AM UTC


Thank you for the heads up! I thought that was probably the case, but I still occasionally wondered. Now I can relax in the full hilarity of it. 😀

Also, Lynn, I also agree about Pet misunderstanding him sometimes. We had some awesome relationship moments between Pet and Athelas this book in the midst and aftermath of him killing her, and she’s always trusted Zero. However, she tends to be dismissive of Jinyeong’s actions in a way she isn’t with the others that sometimes surprises me. He definitely annoys/likes to annoy her in a way Zero and Athelas don’t though, so I suppose it’s the cross he’ll have to bear, haha.

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W.R. Gingell

June 24, 2019 at 12:29 AM UTC


Not to worry, Faith–JinYeong wears cologne because he likes the smell 😀 He’s very dress and personal tidiness oriented, as you may have noticed… 😀

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Faith

June 23, 2019 at 09:49 PM UTC


I know!! My sister and I have been a little worried that e’s wearing cologne to hide his stench. :/We’re hoping not because it’s kind of a gross thought.

Faith Kim

June 22, 2019 at 11:12 PM UTC


On another note, I also loved this book! I have skimmed it SO many times. The development of Pet’s relationship with all the characters were awesome, and seeing Athelas’ soft spot for her was so great. I also noticed how he treated her more gently each time as well. 🙂 Detective Tuatu really grew on me in this one. He was hilarious, and he made me really attached to his role in their team!
I suspect Pet is an heirling- but if she is we just have to figure out why everyone’s only sensing human in her (besides her not smelling like “food” to Jinyeong) and why, if she’s part Fae, Jinyeong’s spit doesn’t have any negative effects on her.
I would also think Pet prefers all of them in different ways for different reasons, much like you might prefer your mom, dad, or siblings. It’s not that you totally prefer one over the other per say so much as you prefer them in different ways because they are different people who play different roles in your life. In the visceral, childlike wholehearted sense, Zero seems to be her favorite, but she also has a special friendship/mentorship with Athelas that’s different then Zero’s, whereas Jinyeong’s kind of like her buddy and confidante (without words…? Can you be a confidante without using words? Because for whatever reason, that’s what I feel Jinyeong is) in his own, weird way that other two can’t because they’re Fae. So it’s hard to see if she has an ultimate favorite, favorite.

Lynn

June 23, 2019 at 06:15 PM UTC


I see it the same way about her not having favorites but different types of relationships with each psycho. Each have their own subtleties and unique defining features and it is fun to watch them evolve.

Faith Kim

June 23, 2019 at 09:51 PM UTC


Yes, it so fun. 🙂

Faith Kim

June 22, 2019 at 10:57 PM UTC


In terms of hilarity… There is so much hilarity in these books it’s way too hard to choose! But I do find myself belly laughing at Jinyeong the most. Part of it is because I’m Korean, so I can actually understand his antics and what he’s saying all the time. And it’s innately amusing for me to see him busting out in all his cocky, otherworldly vampire glory then muttering to himself about Pet or whatever else is going on like a typical middle aged Korean ahjumma or ahjussi. XD So many one liners from him- some of them funny because, well, he’s Jinyeong, but others just because many of his comments in Korean have this mundanely, hilariously realistic quality to them. In the last post, W.R. Gingell talked about how she incorporated more than just the language into the series, and let me just confirm- boy did she do it well! Don’t get me wrong- Koreans do NOT act like psycho Korean vampires with temperaments like Jinyeong’s… But if there were a psycho Korean vampire with a temperment like Jinyeong’s… he would totally act like that, haha! From habits, to food choices, to the way he talks, against all odds I find myself relate to him on the basis that I understand his culture, even if everything else is cosmically different. And it cracks me up. I mean, c’mon, from the start. A Korean vampire? GARLIC? Hilarious!

Caitlin

June 24, 2019 at 10:27 AM UTC


Not City Between related, but if you have not already read “Lady of Dreams” by WR, I highly recommend it. It has a very different setting and vibe than City Between, but it is inspired by K-drama and really really good 🙂

Lynn

June 25, 2019 at 06:32 PM UTC


I plan on checking out more by this author once I finish this read along. Oh, and finish my stack of library books too, I haven’t seen any K-dramas so I can’t predict how the book fit will be over urban fantasy like this one but I’ll give anything a try.

Caitlin

June 26, 2019 at 12:03 AM UTC


I don’t watch much kdrama either, but if you like regency works (e.g. anything by Georgette Heyer or Jane Austin) or Gaslamp fantasy (e.g. Newt’s Emerald by Garth Nix or Ghostlight by Rabia Gale) I think you will enjoy Lady of Dreams. To me it has the sort of gentle pacing and emphasis on interpersonal relationships that I associate with those books. Honestly though, I love all of WR Gingell’s books. She also has a series of fantastic fairy tale retellings that I am sure any KM Shea fan will love 🙂

Lynn

June 26, 2019 at 12:34 AM UTC


Thanks Caitlyn, that’s helpful! I’ll be giving more of her books a try. Quick question- is she an author who likes love triangles and that type of angst? If so, can you forewarn about which books/series will contain it because I don’t usually do well with love triangles and such but sometimes if I know they are coming can read books with them.

Lynn

June 26, 2019 at 01:06 AM UTC


It does help. Thank you Caitlin! (By the way, I keep trying to spell your name with an I instead of a Y. I don’t know why that spelling is so ingrained. Sorry about that!)

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Caitlin

June 26, 2019 at 01:02 AM UTC


No problem! I would say generally no to love triangles and definitely no to angst! I typically dislike those things too 🙂 I can think of only two books (Spindle and Lady of Weeds) where two different male leads fall in love with the same woman. But I would not characterizing either book as angsty, because no one gets betrayed or ends up permanently broken hearted or anything really depressing like that. In both cases, everything resolves beautifully and everyone gets a happily ever after—either later in the same book or later in the series. Hope that helps!

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Faith

June 25, 2019 at 02:54 AM UTC


I actually have read it! I binged a bunch of W.R. Gingell books in the wait for Between Floor, and it was one of the first I checked. As you said, very, very different from City Between, but still very good! Well, except for the fact that it was difficult to decide who the girl was going to end up with. In that sense, I suppose it’s similar, haha.

Kate

June 22, 2019 at 08:54 PM UTC


I think Pet is most attached to Zero, she trusts him more than the other two. Her relationships with A and JL are more teasing and occasionally spiky. She’s loyal to all of them though.

Rachael Liankatawa

June 26, 2019 at 06:50 AM UTC


I wish I knew what JinYeong was saying!!!! Maybe we should hire you to make a translation of all the scenes he’s in lol! I love that the 3rd and 4th books have given us more translation. It might be part of the reason why I am liking him better. Of course, I always felt like the author did a brilliant job making it so we sort of understood him even if we didn’t have a clue what the words were.

Faith

June 26, 2019 at 09:14 AM UTC


Haha, if someone made a compilation I suppose I could help our. 😀 Yes, there’s always been a part of me that wonders what it would be like if I couldn’t understand! Ms. W.R. Gingell said that she wrote some of his scenes with the intention of not really wanting the readers’ to know what he’s saying, so I’ve always wondered what the fun would be on the flipside.
Also, “Nae Kkoya. Manjiji ma!” literally means “Mine. Don’t touch!” As a note, if it sounds a little weird because there’s no subjects (i.e. she’s mine/it’s mine), it’s because in Korean oftentimes you just cut out the subject and it’s simply implied in the sentence.

Caitlin

June 27, 2019 at 09:23 AM UTC


Faith, in terms of what it is like to not get the Korean….I think the experience is not *that* different. From what I can tell, JinYeong only very rarely says something that really alters our perception of the scene. Instead I think JinYeong’s Korean dialogue is like the Highway Man reference in this book. You don’t have to get it (and I certainly didn’t) to love, enjoy, and understand the book. But if you do manage to figure it out, it adds an extra little something to the experience—like an easter egg in a movie or video game.
Side note: WR is brilliant at these sorts of crafty and delightful little extras. It makes me very happy on the rare occasion that I figure one out 😀

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Rachael Liankatawa

June 26, 2019 at 05:24 PM UTC


Faith that is interesting, Thai is the same way with subjects. I always find the differences between languages fascinating. (Ok so maybe Between Languages could be the title of one of these books and it could have JinYeong translated 😂)

“Mine. Don’t touch.” I can see how understanding the language would make JinYeong more endearing. Of course he eventually won me over anyway.

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Elizabeth

June 26, 2019 at 11:35 AM UTC


Thanks so much Rachael, Caitlin and Faith! I’d been wondering about that for a long time. So “mine” instead of “ours” huh? Interesting choice.

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Elizabeth

June 26, 2019 at 07:31 AM UTC


Yes, it is really nice that we get to understand more now that Pet does. There are a few things I’ve always wondered about, especially in the first two books. Like what JinYeong says in the first book right after Pet’s awful boss slams something into her leg. He says “Nae kkoya. Manjiji ma!” It’s obvious he’s angry, it would just be nice to know what he said. I liked that he made the boss pay for it.

Rachael Liankatawa

June 26, 2019 at 08:12 AM UTC


I think manjiji means don’t touch so I think he was telling her boss not to touch Pet again. But that’s just my best guess!

Caitlin

June 26, 2019 at 08:54 AM UTC


I spent a shameful amount of time on the internet this read through trying to figure out the Korean. If I got it correct (and that is a big “if”), the whole things translates to something like “It’s mine. Don’t touch it.” Which is both endearing and insulting in true JinYeong fashion lol.

Lynn

June 26, 2019 at 05:53 PM UTC


Lol, yes, it’s very Jin Yeong- a little endearing and a little insulting. You said that perfectly Caitlin!

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W.R. Gingell

June 26, 2019 at 09:20 AM UTC


10/10 for your GoogleFu!

(￣ー￣)ｂ

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Elizabeth

June 24, 2019 at 07:29 AM UTC


I agree. She’s loyal to all of them, and has a different relationship with each. I also think that she sees Zero as as more of a Dad, and that he’s somewhat baffled to be falling into that role.

Caitlin

June 24, 2019 at 10:03 AM UTC


I agree that he is very confused by Pet and the “unexpected things” she does. Like hug him. I loved that scene.

Eleniel

June 24, 2019 at 06:40 PM UTC


Me too- that scene was perfect! My problem is, my mind can’t get around the original descriptions of the psychos from the first chapter of Between Jobs- where Athelas looks about forty and Zero mid-thirties. With Pet being seventeen, imagining a romantic relationship between her and one of them just gets creepy to me. Athelas seems like an older uncle sort of role, and Zero seems big brothery. JinYeong could be like a distant cousin or twin brother- someone you play with and purposely annoy the crap out of. So yeah, I’m kind of leaning toward a ship with either JinYeong or Tuatu, since they’re closer to her age.

Rachael Liankatawa

June 25, 2019 at 07:57 PM UTC


I saw Zero as the main romantic interest in the first 2 books. I think because we don’t actually know what he thinks so I interpreted his actions as having more feeling than maybe they had. All his protectiveness could be taken as romantic interest (even though he would be unaware of his feelings).

And I can’t remember how old Tuatu is but for some reason I had him pegged in his 30s…too old for Pet. For some reason age differences among Fae and humans don’t bother me the same way. So even though Zero was described older I didn’t view him that way. Athelas though seems much too old for Pet. Definitely an eccentricUncle!

I didn’t like JinYeong at all in the first 2 books. He seemed too eager to harm Pet but he’s definitely grown on me in a way that if he doesn’t end up with Pet, I want him to find love somewhere. He needs a happy ending!

Caitlin

June 27, 2019 at 09:11 AM UTC


I think it is fascinating the way all of us seem to have focused on different “clues”, depending on our interests, perspectives etc. In my case, I know there were definitely things I overlooked about JinYeong in my first couple of read-throughs.

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Faith

June 26, 2019 at 02:42 AM UTC


It is so interesting for me to see how many people felt that way about Jinyeong for the first two books. I actually thought how much he cared for her was as obvious as how much Zero cared for her- which is to say, not very obvious, but still there in brief, subtle moments. But, again, as I mentioned in a different comment, I was kind of interpreting things from the perspective of a Korean and by default am a tiny bit of a cheater because I understand all the untranslated bits of Korean, haha.
I’m also with Lynn on this one that you both may end up right! I felt the opposite of intuitive for possible love interests. I never even considered Zero and just barely considered Jinyeong as a possibility, and pretty much thought Tuatu was the main option. I felt so slow when I saw what everyone else had to say! And even though I still sense more familial feelings from Zero, I still feel like it’s pretty possible for that to change.

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Lynn

June 26, 2019 at 12:47 AM UTC


Caitlin and Rachael, you both may still end up being right and then you get bragging rights, lol!

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Caitlin

June 26, 2019 at 12:39 AM UTC


I was also a diehard member of #TeamZero for the first three books (I read them all as they were released and have read them multiple times since). And I think Rachel perfectly explained my logic at the time.
I will just add that (as KM Shea pointed out) a lot of us are not used to seeing this much care, depth, and attention being paid to the formation of plutonic friendships. It is one of the unique and wonderful things about this series. But as a ship happy little reader who prefers to know early on who the romantic leads will be, I tended to interpret things in a certain light. And Zero did things that, in many other books or series, would indicate the beginnings of romantic feelings. Even though he argued the hardest against keeping Pet, he went farther than anyone in trying to protect her. And in book 1, Athelas tried to “warn” Pet about Zero and his inability to love, (a classic Obstacle To Romance in my eyes). Then in book 2, Athelas tried to explain to Pet that there was no logical reason for Zero to be trying so hard to save her life, thereby showing that Zero was growing fond of her. Even fairly prosaic things like the fact that Zero is the leader of the Troika, in another style of book, would indicate the he is The Male Lead. So I kinda leapt to conclusions. Having read more books, and reread the early ones, I am no longer convinced that Pet will fall in *romantic love* with Zero, and I am ok with that. Just took me awhile to catch up with some of you more intuitive folks 😀

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Faith

June 25, 2019 at 03:44 AM UTC


Eleniel, I actually felt a very similar way! The early descriptions of how old they look got/gets to me too. When only the first two books were out, until I started looking at what other people were thinking, I thought Tuatu was the main candidate for being a love interest, with a hint of a possibility for Jinyeong. For the whole first two books I loved Zero and Pet (and I still do!), but I thought it was such lovely, big brother/sister type friendship (which is one of my all-time favorites in books, but hard to find sometimes). And, obviously, I thought it was purely platonic, so I was actually really shocked when I decided to check out what other people thought and found out he was seen as pretty much the main contender. Aaand that pretty much no one else at that point even CONSIDERED Tuatu a possibility, haha! (I was like, wow, so many years of reading and I was this off??)
Obviously, fellow readers’ comments aside, when book three came around I started to see the possibility of there being something between Pet and Zero or Jinyeong shoot up quite a bit (especially on Jinyeong’s end), and the possibility go down with Tuatu (it seems like they’re going to have a pretty epic friendship), but, like you said, because of the description of their ages when they were first introduced and the completely platonic, not-even-a-hint-of-romance-in-the-future type of I way perceived Pet’s relationship with Zero for the first two books, it’s hard for me to feel completely comfortable with the thought.
Especially for Athelas- yes, eccentric uncle is the perfect word for him, and he’s just way too old. I really love his and Pet’s relationship as well, but in the uncle way! But it doesn’t seem like Pet’s going to get any feelings for him or vice versa any time soon, so I feel like it’s a bit of a moot point. Jinyeong is and at least looks a little younger (At least, I think he’s physically supposed to look a little younger than Zero), so a romance with him always seemed more comfortable for me.
A question for everyone though. I still kind of feel like Zero and Pet have and will end up keeping an awesome big brother type relationship. Maybe it’s because I’m someone where his age messed with my perspective of it from the get-go, but it still feels like Pet adores him in the protective brother/friend sort of way. And for some reason, I see the possibility of that changing less then her ending up feeling something for Jinyeong, even though she clearly has less then zero feelings of romance for the vampire at the moment (haha, Zero puns unintended, although it’s surprisingly perfect for what I was trying to say).

Faith

June 26, 2019 at 02:13 AM UTC


Yes it does! I was mostly just wondering if I was the only one getting very strong familial vibes rather then romantic vibes. Which is actually mentioned a lot in this thread, but at the times I hadn’t fully realized it. 🙂

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Lynn

June 25, 2019 at 06:28 PM UTC


Faith, I too have interpreted her reaction to Zero’s in a non romantic protective role right now. Pet was alone without anyone, much less a family, for so long, that I got the vibe Zero made her feel safest, She sees him as an ultimate protector. She sees him as this gruff guy who has a little bit of the heart of a teddy bear inside hidden away that she sees peeks of now and again. I think the comfort and affinity she feels around him is like related to needing that in her life. At the start of this series she’s missing her family when these three show up and Zero offers her the most sense of protection which she craves. So while I do see their relationship likely to evolve as all friendships do (and kids with parents, brothers, etc. as they grow), I do see that their relationship is likely to be primarily grounded that way and maintaining. Does that answer what you were asking?

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Elizabeth

June 25, 2019 at 03:38 AM UTC


That’s a really good point. We don’t know what exactly Pet is, she could live a really long time. In the scenario of Pet and JinYeong ending up together, I had been wondering if Pet would need to be vampirized, or if JinYeong could be turned human again. It might be neither one of those are necessary.

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Caitlin

June 25, 2019 at 02:50 AM UTC


I can totally understand the “perception” issue. I have had that same problem with other books (*glares at the copy of Fire and Hemlock on the bookshelf*). And I really can’t picture Pet with Athelas. The “eccentric uncle” title someone else gave him just fits too perfectly. But, for whatever reason, the age between Pet, Zero, and JinYeong bothers me much less. Maybe because we don’t actually know how old Zero is, or how his age is perceived by other Fae? Is he young in Fae years at least? And hey at least JinYeong was born in the same century as Pet. Also we don’t know what Pet is. Maybe she will have a very long lifespan too?

Caitlin

June 25, 2019 at 03:33 AM UTC


Haha of course that would be your favorite DWJ book. Very fitting 😉 I confess to being quite cross with that book for about a week after I first read it back in high school. Imagine, a narrator that isn’t omnipotent?! A protagonist who is not as he first appears?! What a scandalous outrage! But that was just the first time I read it. On subsequent readings, I learned to appreciate it for the masterpiece it is 🙂

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W.R. Gingell

June 25, 2019 at 03:16 AM UTC


Wait, you love Fire and Hemlock, too?? That’s such a huge favourite of mine! That one and Hexwood are two of my favourite DWJ books–she was the MASTER of intricate plotting and you-don’t-have-to-explain-everything!

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Caitlin

June 25, 2019 at 03:05 AM UTC


Oh, this was meant as a reply to what Eleniel said about the original description of the Psychos and how that shapes our perception of them.

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Lynn

June 24, 2019 at 09:16 PM UTC


I’m with you about not envisioning a romance with Athelas or Zero and Pet. Their relationships with Pet have always had an uncle (Athelas) or parental/protective in an older non-romantic way (Zero) vibe to me. It’s not just the appearance of age though that is part of it. Another part of it for me is the power differential. There is too much of a power differential right now for me to feel comfortable with romance with either of them. It is possible (and likely) that with the remaining books Pet will grow into her own and won’t read as young and be on a more even playing field with them but it will be hard to get these books and the current dynamic out of my head even if that happens. Then throw in that age difference and I get uncomfortable with it. It would be a LOT to overcome.

However, with Jin Yeong, there doesn’t seem to be as big of a power differential to overcome. He’s been in this world longer but he’s an outsider just like Pet. He’s only partly accepted and doesn’t have as much power as the Fae seem to have nor the respect. Right now though, I don’t sense any romantic vibe or interest from Pet for him but that could change easily in the future.

As for Tuatu, what is his age again? I’ve forgotten and the character I have visualized in my head is around lower 40’s so I haven’t thought of him as a romantic potential either. I don’t know why that’s my visual and it’s highly likely that I missed his age in the first book because there was so much to take in about all of the characters and situations.

At any rate, for the moment I’m not shipping anyone with Pet because I haven’t sensed any interest from her about any of the characters in the main books. As a matter of fact, the novella is the first time I sensed any possible interest for her in a character and that went nowhere due to the situation. However, once Pet becomes aware of interest in someone I’ll be more invested but it needs to come from her. In this series, she needs to have the power in choice since she has so little choice or power in most everything else going on in her life.

Eleniel

June 28, 2019 at 08:26 PM UTC


Thank you! I didn’t think that either of them could have fit in the first four. (Actually, I didn’t connect the dude in the coffee shop with Marazul until I reread it after reading Shades of Blue. I was so excited cause I actually knew who that was!)

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W.R. Gingell

June 27, 2019 at 11:38 PM UTC


Yeah, Goodreads is just confused 😀 Now that I’ve had a chance to get a closer look at the timeline, Cloudy should take place after book 5 and Shades of Blue is (I think!) between books 6 & 7. I finally caught up! (nearly…)

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Caitlin

June 27, 2019 at 06:26 PM UTC


Goodreads is probably thinks it is 3.5 based on when it was released for individual sale. I know for sure it is later than anything else that has been released so far. I think W.R. said on Facebook that “Cloudy with a Chance of Drop Bears” takes place around book 5 or 6 and “All the Different Shades of Blue” is around book 7 or 8, but I am not 100% sure. Hopefully can clarify that for us in one of these discussions.

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Lynn

June 27, 2019 at 06:13 PM UTC


On Goodreads it was listed as 3.5 but that can’t be right. I just read book 4 and it looks like that’s the first time ‘Zul shows up in a quick peek. Plus, it can’t happen between 4 and 5 because of certain events in book 4 (at the end) that I can’t discuss until Saturday. So I’m curious when it occurs too.

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Eleniel

June 27, 2019 at 05:38 PM UTC


Speaking of ‘Zul, does anyone know where Shades of Blue fits into the City Between timeline? I think it has to be after Between Floors- that’s where all of the relationships seem to start cementing- but I’m not sure other than that.

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Caitlin

June 27, 2019 at 09:07 AM UTC


Yeah, I hear you Eleniel on feeling torn. There are several characters I can picture her with, but I really don’t know where things are going….or even where I want them to go at this point. Plus, even though I adore Marazul, the fact that his story comes in so much later in the series than everything else just makes things even more confusing some how. Oh well, I’m enjoying the ride and it is still really fun to speculate.

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Eleniel

June 26, 2019 at 04:19 AM UTC


I’m torn… I love Tuatu and am rooting for him, but after reading Shades of blue and seeing ‘Zul’s HUGE crush on Pet…
It could be a really good thing for her to date someone who is so in awe of her. And I really liked Marazul. But Tuatuuuuuu!!!!

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Caitlin

June 26, 2019 at 01:35 AM UTC


I DON’T KNOW AND IT IS KILLING ME!
I love love love Shades of Blue. It is my second favorite entry in the entire series so far (after Between Floors). So I would be very happy to see that happen, but I never know where things are going in this series so I guess I am just going to have to wait to find out. *sigh*

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Lynn

June 26, 2019 at 12:43 AM UTC


Caitlynn, you didn’t come across as critical at all. I just know that with writing things down sometimes meaning isn’t clear and was trying to clarify. I love book discussions and how they make you consider ways of looking at it all with different perspectives and insights. However, I prefer in person book discussions because it’s easier to get your meaning across and I know that I sometimes don’t communicate my ideas as well as I think I do. But I’m loving the back and forth here and am enjoying getting your’s and other’s takes on all of it.

That’s good to know that she’ll be going on a date in the future and it will reverberate with the psychos in interesting ways. I think when she starts getting more and more agency and coming into her own it will even up all the dynamics. I also don’t think Pet is the only one who needs growth to be ready for romance as many here have alluded to as well. I can’t decide if Jin Yeong is a red herring or if we are supposed to root for him. Do you think the date will be with a certain Mer character from the novella?

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Caitlin

June 26, 2019 at 12:16 AM UTC


Lynn, that makes COMPLETE sense. If I am understanding correctly this time, you are saying (in part) that Pet needs to mature emotionally and reconnect with her humanity before she gets involved with anyone. And part of that process should involve some conscious consideration of dating/romance/etc. I completely agree with that. WR did recently mention on Facebook that later in the series Pet is going to go on a date with “….someone” and it is going to cause some strong (and presumably hilarious) reactions among the Psychos. So, I think we are definitely going to see what you are talking about with Pet consciously expressing an interest in at least the idea of romance and making her first forays into the world of dating on her own terms.

And I hope I didn’t come across as critical earlier. I was just fondly musing on what we know about Pet’s personality. I love how wise and blind she can be at the same time. Keeps things very interesting to say the least! But yes, I agree that much has been thrust upon Pet, and it will be good to see her taking more control in the future.

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Eleniel

June 25, 2019 at 07:52 PM UTC


Thank you, Faith- I knew I wasn’t crazy! I do think it was that he was not much older than Pet. If anybody can find the sentence about Tuatu’s age, can they post it in a comment? For my sanity?

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Lynn

June 25, 2019 at 06:16 PM UTC


Caitlyn, I should clarify that I don’t expect the romantic feelings to initially come from Pet. I agree that she wouldn’t recognize them if they developed without some help. I’m just saying that for me to ship her with anyone I have to feel like she’s realized it’s what she wants. I don’t want her to fall into something like she’s fallen into so much of everything else. I want her to realize it’s what she wants. Therefore I’m not shipping her with anyone because, right now, she’s too disconnected with those types of feelings. Once they arrive (or rather are acknowledged even just subconsciously in a way we can see) then I’ll start shipping. However, right now all we get is the way everyone else is possibly responding to her and that’s not enough for me in this scenario to ship anyone just yet. Does that make more sense?

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Faith

June 25, 2019 at 04:13 AM UTC


Also, Caitlin I totally agree with you that if Pet does start having romantic feelings for someone, it’s going to take her by surprise. Like you said, it really doesn’t seem like romance is the type occupies her mind. 😀

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Faith

June 25, 2019 at 04:08 AM UTC


Lynn, thank you for the comment! I was having trouble formulating why I felt the way I felt at possibly seeing a romance with Zero or Athelas vs Jinyeong at this point until I read what you wrote. You perfectly described part of how I feel, but couldn’t quite put my finger on. Although I also agree that this could change as the series progresses and characters grow.
I’m not a hundred percent sure, but I think it was mentioned somewhere early on that Tuatu is somewhere in his early twenties-ish. Or that he looked like it. Or that it seemed like he was only several years older then Pet or something of the sort.

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Caitlin

June 25, 2019 at 03:03 AM UTC


It is interesting that you are waiting for Pet to show signs of romantic interest first. I am the opposite 😛 I keep waiting for one of the guys to form a noticeable attachment. Personally, I think that when Pet does develop romantic feelings for someone, it is going to take her very much by surprise. I just don’t think that romance is really something that occupies her mind. (Small no-context spoiler: I think ‘Zul had her pegged when he observed that she doesn’t seem the type to make the first move). For that reason, I also think she is unlikely to notice someone else’s attention or interpret it in a romantic way. So again, I think she may be a bit shocked if/when someone declares himself.

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Eleniel

June 24, 2019 at 09:57 PM UTC


You’re right about the power difference- I didn’t really think about it that way, but it was something I subconsciously noticed.
I can’t find it, but I’m pretty sure the first book mentions that he’s younger- I always assumed he’s somewhere in his twenties. Anyone know for sure?

Natalie Smoot

June 22, 2019 at 07:45 PM UTC


Here’s the thing about Morgana. In some fairy lore there is a woman called the Morgan. A very powerful fae she is different in many of them but I have a theory that she is that woman. So that’s interesting. I can’t say more because I cheated and read ahead and I don’t want to give anything away.

Kadi

June 24, 2019 at 01:19 AM UTC


I totally think she is more then she seems! I’m excited to find out more about her!

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Lynn

June 22, 2019 at 08:27 PM UTC


Ooooo, now you have me wanting to google Morgana!

Lynn

June 22, 2019 at 07:16 PM UTC


I forgot to write about the funniest parts. I agree with you in that the texts were my favorites. I also agree with your heirling thoughts.

Lynn

June 22, 2019 at 07:17 PM UTC


This comment was supposed to be in response to Eleniel on
June 22, 2019 at 1:19 pm Don’t know why it posted here. O.o

Lynn

June 22, 2019 at 07:08 PM UTC


I have been waiting to discuss this book since the second I finished! So excited!!

I’m writing my thoughts before reading others so I can keep it all straight. In this book a lot of things came to light. I will mention that I also read the novella right after and that it also illuminated some stuff about the Psychos so I’ll try to keep it all to this book but might forget what information I have comes from this book.

I feel like I understand the psychos better and why Zero keeps an appearance of distance (an attempt for distance). The way both Athelas and Zero reacted to Pet constantly allowing herself to be killed (even thought Athelas thought she was a fake it so obviously affected him). Seeing the way Athlas reacted to having to kill the “fake” Pet was powerful. Jim Yeong’s strange reactions to Pet are interesting. It’s like the little boy annoying the girl he likes because he wants her attention. There is definitely something on his side though Pet seems to be pretty good at not recognizing her own feelings about things so it’s hard to get a read on whether there is any potential besides brotherly feelings. I think we might get hints to which way she might go in future books.

I personally don’t think Athelas killed Pet’s parents. Pet has, herself, gone into sort of a berserker mode when killing those troll like creatures in the between. That’s a clue in some kind of way. Do all Fae have berserker modes? Or did someone kill Pet’s parents and Pet went into berserker mode and killed whoever killed her parents but repressed the memory? We know there is something much more there on that night than Pet allows herself to actively recall. Or did the Fae who killed her parents go into berserker mode when killing her parents (perhaps the parents were better fighters than we are assuming)? Or was someone(s) else there the night they died that killed so violently maybe killing Pet’s parents killers? If only Fae have berserker modes does that mean that Pet is part Fae?

I still don’t think Pet is a changeling. I do think there are hints that she could be a heirling. I’m not sure if that is a red herring or if it’s real but we all know there is something different about Pet and we don’t really know what her Psychos actually know about her. Does her berserker side mean part Fae? I don’t think it’s anything that cut and dried or it seems like the Psychos would know. However, we are in Pet’s perspective and see them how she sees them. She sees them as all knowing and maybe they aren’t as all knowing as we assume. As a matter of fact, I’m pretty sure they have more limits than she realizes (be it in power, knowledge, or capacities).

I thought that Athlelas’ comment about it not being for the best for Pet to forgive him maybe meant he owed her in some way if she did. There is always this talk about how they like to keep things in balance and not owe her when she does them favors. Is this that, but on a deeper level? Is she tying herself to Athelas in some deeper mystical Fae way? Or is it the emotional ramifications? So much to ponder!!

I liked seeing not only Athelas’ soft spot for Pet but also the other two Psychos and the way they reacted her while she willingly went to sleep to get clues to save Athelas though it would mean her death each time. I think that whatever knife’s edge they were walking on with their feelings about her, this will push it over irrevocably.

I still haven’t solved the puzzle by what is meant by Jim Yeong shouldn’t love. I have some vague ideas but they aren’t formed enough to put into bigger ideas. It could be locked up in the way his sister was pulled into his conflicts or the way he reacted when she died. I’m not sure yet.

I don’t think Pet really has a favorite yet. Her feelings are complicated and allows changing. I do thinks that they are becoming her family to her.

Thanks for the Poem. I didn’t realize there was a connection so I’ll go read it. This is much longer than I meant to write so I’ll stop while I’m ahead and go read what everyone else has to say.

Lindsay

June 26, 2019 at 05:41 PM UTC


I dont know, I may be mis-remembering the whole thing, bit didn’t Althelas say something about how JinYeong feels emotions so deeply and that it wouldn’t be wise for him to fall in love. He wouldn’t be able to control himself maybe? It was one of the dream conversations Pet had with Atlethas while he was locked up. He went over what I count as JinYeongs “origin” story at the same time? I remember thinking “Oooo that’s interesting!”

Caitlin

June 27, 2019 at 09:27 AM UTC


Oh, I remember that part too Lindsay, now that you have mentioned it. Athelas said that the change magnifies emotions, and that for the sake of their survival, vampires must quickly learn to control those emotions. He also said that JinYeong is now much more mellow than he used to be. Very interesting indeed!!!

Eleniel

June 27, 2019 at 05:40 PM UTC


And of course Pet scoffs at the idea of JinYeong being “mellow.”

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Lynn

June 26, 2019 at 06:04 PM UTC


I’ve only read the books once so you are probably right. I don’t remember it but hopefully those are the types of things I’ll pick up on a future re-read. That would be very interesting for sure!

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Eleniel

June 23, 2019 at 04:54 PM UTC


What novella are you referring to? If there are more short stories than on the facebook page, I want to read them!

Lynn

June 23, 2019 at 06:05 PM UTC


“All the Different Shades of Blue: A City Between novelette” It’s labeled as 3.5 on Goodreads https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/44413588-all-the-different-shades-of-blue
I also joined the newsletter for the W.R. Gingell and it is included for free if you do that. =)

Eleniel

June 24, 2019 at 01:41 AM UTC


Thank you! Going to do that right now… 🙂

Caitlin

June 26, 2019 at 01:41 AM UTC


Not sure if you already saw, but the other City Between novelette, “Cloudy with a Chance of Drop Bears,” just got published on Amazon KU. It was previously only available as part of an anthology.

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Lynn

June 22, 2019 at 07:13 PM UTC


*always changing not allows changing. My autocorrect is always messing up words and I should probably proof read before posting but usually don’t. So please forgive the to for toos and those types of things.

W.R. Gingell

June 22, 2019 at 05:41 PM UTC


Also, Kitty! THANK YOU for asking about Pet’s preferences! Almost no one does, and it’s lovely to hear (see) it =)

Eleniel

June 22, 2019 at 05:19 PM UTC


I think it’s very likely that Pet is some sort of Heirling- there are so many hints to it. WrG made talking about what they are a pretty big thing, she can do a lot with Between that she shouldn’t be able to, and lets not forget that SHE found the Heirling sword. I don’t think she’s fae, but I do think she’s not fully human.
I completely agree with you- Detective Tuatu’s text messages were the highlight of my day and probably my favorite part of all three books so far! I love the poor detective, and I am absurdly fond of the little dryad. On WrG’s website she had a post on fanart where someone actually made a dryad on a rock out of wire and beads, and it was the CUTEST LITTLE THING! I want one!!
I’m honestly not sure Pet really has preference right now- she very fond of all of her psychos. Actually, I’m kind of rooting for the Detective to win her heart. I feel like they’d be so cute together!

Lynn

June 22, 2019 at 07:15 PM UTC


I forgot to write about the funniest parts. I agree with you in that the texts were my favorites. I also agree with your heirling thoughts.

Colleen

June 22, 2019 at 04:52 PM UTC


Aaaaaaaah!!!! Yes yes – love this one the best of the three so far. Complex relationship with all three and I did not notice Athelas being more tender w Pet w each subsequent killing. Now for a reread!!!

As for hearing or changeling I am so confused about this! pet can’t be behind kind bc vampire and lycanthrope spit is deadly to behind-kind. But I also think Athelas knows who and what she is…. bc of the conversation he had w her at the end of book 1. She is very partial to her house too – oddly so, (who finds a home your parents were murdered in comforting still?) and the oddness comes out in book 3 in the scene w the golden fae. So I can’t help feeling she has something like Behindkind blood but … isn’t??? Bc of the lycanthropy and vampire spit not killing her… I dunno. Wrg is an Athelas-like plot twister.

Here’s a sudden thought: Athelas already knew she was in the house in book 1. He maybe spelled her to want to stay in the house???

Eleniel

June 22, 2019 at 05:32 PM UTC


I think that there’s something about the house itself- it has odd ties to Behind, and it’s a central point in the Troika’s investigation. Also, Pet lived on very little and squirreled all money she could away to save up so she could buy the house when she turned eighteen. I don’t think most people would have such an attachment to a house where their parents were murdered. She could have saved to rent an apartment so she could get away from there- that’s what I would do if I lived in a house where my parents were murdered, on a street where the only other person left was crazy- and then also murdered.

Lynn

June 22, 2019 at 08:26 PM UTC


So I googled entities that are bound to a house and found the Kikimora. I wonder if Pet will have some loose connection to them? They don’t totally translate but they are tied to a home, are female and do the domestic housework. Just a thought.

Eleniel

June 23, 2019 at 04:47 PM UTC


Huh- that’s an interesting thought.

Lynn

June 23, 2019 at 06:22 PM UTC


I figure it’s a long shot and not very likely but it was interesting that there was such a creature! I’m also trying to figure out Morgana and if she is a witch or what exactly she is.

,
W.R. Gingell

June 22, 2019 at 05:11 PM UTC


Ah, I had to clarify this on my FB page as well–it’s fae that can’t take vampire/lycanthrope spit, not all Behindkind in general. The more fae blood a Behindkind has, the more danger they are in of dying of a lycanthrope/vampire bite.

Pet makes a concession to that at some stage when she says “behindkind like Zero” instead of just “Behindkind” (she’s been studying, lol). In the first couple books the psychos mentioned that in certain circumstances vampire spit could “kill Behindkind” but it wasn’t explained until later that it was the fae blood that makes the difference. Obviously I didn’t allude to it well enough, so I’m going to clarify things a bit more in book 5 😀

(Also, I will proudly take the Athelas-like Plot Twister name 😀 )

Colleen

June 24, 2019 at 05:30 AM UTC


Heh I am looking forward to Clockwork Magician!! Much for me to anticipate: two books, and Lady of Weeds whenever WRG finishes…

W.R. Gingell

June 26, 2019 at 06:56 AM UTC


I’m currently having fun with Clockwork Magician 😀 and Lady of Weeds should only have about five more chapters to go, so I’m hoping to whip that into some decent kind of shape well before the end of the year.

The cover is on its way, too–I should see the first iteration of it in the next couple of days, so I’m very excited about that!

Colleen

June 26, 2019 at 10:49 PM UTC


Oh my word!! I didn’t know lady of weeds was so immanent! I’ve been Ron rereading #3, and starting to get restless for some thing new 🥳🥳🥳🥳🥳

,
Lynn

June 22, 2019 at 07:22 PM UTC


Colleen, good catches. And thanks W.R. Gingell for clarifying. So now I’m even more curious, if possible, about what exactly Pet is and where she comes from. When is the next book due? I saw that there will be at least 10 books in the series.

W.R. Gingell

June 23, 2019 at 03:32 AM UTC


Book 5 will be out before Christmas =) I have a final book in another series that’s been waiting to be written for far too long, so I’m working on writing and publishing both by the end of the year!

Lynn

June 23, 2019 at 06:20 PM UTC


Yay, I’m super excited for the next book! I read the last book out yesterday (couldn’t stop myself any longer). I’m not one of the fans that will ever rush you to publish as I know that authors have lives to and self care is important. So I will wait patiently for each and be grateful when you do finish them.

W.R. Gingell

June 24, 2019 at 12:33 AM UTC


=) <3

Jun 22, 20195 min read

Reading Discussion: Between Floors


BetweenfloorDiscussion

Let’s get ready to RUMBLE!! It’s time for the reading discussion of Between Floors! (So excited, so excited, SO EXCITED!!)


There is so much to unpack! This book has a whole lot of revelations, from learning JinYeong’s transformation into a vampire–and the story of his sister which explains why Zero has been careful to (sort of) keep Pet at an arm’s length for anything besides protecting her. We learn that the series’ foes aren’t just the serial killer from book 1, but also Behindkind who seem to be prepping for some sort of coup.


Most importantly, WE LEARNED ATHELAS HAS A BIG SOFT SPOT FOR PET! I just LOVE Athelas’ friendship with Pet! It’s for certain my favorite part of the whole story. (Yes, I have friendship ships, and I will go down with them!)


The soft spot is apparent in a multitude of ways–from the fact that the shadowy foes who captured Athelas used Pet’s appearance to question him, to the fact that it made him really mad that they used her, even to the way you can see each time he “kills” her it makes him more and more upset. (Did anyone else notice that with every time he killed her, he held her more and more gently/closely?)


In a chat with my author friend Kenley Davidson about Athelas and Pet, she theorized that Athelas killed Pet’s parents. (Because the rather…er…gorey way he dismembered those who had captured him is reminiscent of her parents’ deaths.) I have to acknowledge the similarities, but it might just be that fae are violent like that in general. (Though it certainly seems like one of the twisty twists W. R. might pull on us.)

Moving on to Zero, we did see he obviously cares more for his friends than he lets on (or than Athelas believes) based on how worried he was for Athelas. We also saw, for the first time, that he chose Pet’s well being over his friends’ in a rather playful way at the end when he puts that spell on her that zaps JinYeong.


And JinYeong. Don’t even get me started. By the end of the book that vampire has got it BAD for Pet. We see it in the whole book (Buwahahah that kiss was hilarious) I think—I think–he might even possibly be looking at her in more of a romantic sense and less of a pet sense.

Remember last week when we discussed Athelas and Pet talking love and their merry little band? Athelas said JinYeong can love but shouldn’t. At the very end of Between Floors, when Athelas warns Pet as she’s attempting to yank JinYeong’s jacket off so she can clean it, he tells her “It’s more work than it’s worth,” I’m fairly certain he was referring back to his warning that JinYeong shouldn’t love.


And while we’re on that particular line, I’m positive Athelas now loves Pet as well (I don’t think it’s in a romantic sense as much as it is familial or friendship) because when she’s dragging him out and informs him she’s going to forgive him, he tell’s her not to, because it’s not going to do either of them any good. My theory is he knew if she forgive him, she would become that much more important to him. (Which, this is Athelas. Even if he’s fond of Pet he’s not going to enjoy knowing he has a weakness!)


But turning away from the more relationship-driven aspect of the series, after seeing all of Pet’s newest tricks, how many of you think she’s an heirling or a changling? (Or rather an heirling changling? Because she obviously knew nothing about between or behindkind before meeting the trio.) OR!!! As we know because of the werewolves, maybe it’s possible that she’s not fae but an entirely different sort of behindkind?

I’m also very interested to see what happens to the sick girl she met in the apartment building across from Daniel’s…hospital(?) room. “The Kids” might be behindkind? Or something else–there has got to be more to her than meets the eye.


And as a side note, the text message sequence from the detective is quite possibly the most hilarious and life-like thing I have ever read. I had to put the book down and re-read it twice I was laughing so hard. A close second was when Pet was informing Zero she couldn’t possibly go to bed because her owner got back and “us pets get too excited when our owners get home.”


Finally, I wanted to add that this book is my favorite because of Athelas, but it’s also because I am a huge fan of the poem “The Highway Man” by Alfred Noyes, and Between Floors actually contains a key reference to it, which explains some of Athelas’ mutterings while being captive. If you haven’t read The Highway Man you can click here to read it, but the basic premise is that a highway man is in love with a young lady named Bess and visits her at night. Soldiers are told of his presence, so the next night when he would visit, the soldiers are waiting in Bess’ room and tie a musket to her chest. To warn him, Bess fires off the musket, warning off the highwayman and sacrificing her life.


The poem ends in a tragedy–the highwayman finds out about Bess’ death and dies attempting to avenge her–but there is a particular line in the poem “I’ll come to thee by moonlight, though hell should bar the way!” which particularly applies to Athelas’ situation, considered he his held there by moonlight. (He even recites that specific line of the poem.) This is why he and Pet finally break free when he stabs himself, and why he was so reluctant to do so.


It’s a beautiful part of the story…though I’ll admit I laughed really hard when I asked W. R. how upset Athelas was when he realized that he was Bess–the female love interest–in the story. (The answer: Extremely.) I’ll ask W. R. a few questions about this aspect of Between Floors next week, but here’s a few questions we can chew on in the comments in the meantime:

  1. Do you think Pet is an heir, a changling, or something else?

  2. Out of the three books we’ve read so far, what do you think is the funniest line/scene?

  3. Which of Athelas, Zero, and JinYeong do you think Pet prefers–or even, does she have a preference?


The last question is one I’m especially interested in because I have spent a lot of my time trying to decipher which of the three likes Pet the most, but in writing up this discussion post for you, I realized it never occurred to me to wonder who Pet prefers. I think she’s said in previous books that Zero is her biggest target to ingratiate herself with because he’s most likely to protect her, but she has also said she does lots of extra stuff for Athelas because he will actually tell her information. But I don’t know that either of those acts indicates a preference.


What do you think, Champions?

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